Well said too. Anything is worth what the market will pay for it except in the case of Insurance valuation where value is slightly different.
Well said too. Anything is worth what the market will pay for it except in the case of Insurance valuation where value is slightly different.
Yeah its cool. Im not that stressed about it. I got good cash for it and put an EFI 304 in my VH SL/E... And as these 22 pages and others have shown theres a million what-ifs... I dont mind having an incorrect engine at least, as if it puts a piston through the block, you havent just taken 5 grand value from your car. You just get another engine...Originally Posted by Vombil
lots 'n lots of them dont have the right engine and unless you have the origional documents who would even know. We know that the number range can be determined and you can spend your life hunting blocks and get close.
Back in the eighties I blew the 308 in the SLR5000 racing my mates XC on the way to Batherst. The go then for penniless people was to roll the car into an engine reconditioner and pick it up in the arvo. Thousand skins and you were back on the road, all sweet.
I guess unless it was special like an L34 moter any reco'ed L31 was the same to most people then. As these motors hardly last 40 years if driven and most of these cars were not shedded with an eye to keeping them... I would imagine most would of been swapped at some stage whatever the sellers tells you.
Mauser
“485650 HQ's cant be wrong...”
“You don’t drive a Kingswood, you make love to it. That’s why nuns only drive Toranas.” - Ted Bullpitt
Problem today is it isn't that hard in many cases to find the original engine number, or at least the one that was in the vehicle at the 1000kM service.
Hey Goat,
Welcome aboard.
The vehicle, technically does not have a compliance plate. Yes. Because it can no longer be 100% verified to comply with the ADRs on it. Below is a statement that shows how they get around this and it states if the model has been recognised as model before all is still ok. But, the standard states the vehicle can continue being the vehicle is it. No need for a new rego. Same vehicle. The vehicle has a vehicle plate to identify the vehicle and the vehicle is made up of many parts.
We are debating that the vehicle takes on the identity of the donor chassis. Can someone please highlight the clause that says this.
By the way. If it sounds like I am posting in a shouty voice, sorry, I am not.
I have highlighted a clause that states the vehicle remains unchanged.
A vehicle currently registered in NSW and not fitted with a compliance plate can continue to be
registered providing it remains roadworthy.
hqgts also posted this up (note: where it says "stamped on body" in our case the body is a chassis.)
A previously registered vehicle (second hand vehicle) where the chassis/VIN number stamped on the
body does not match the chassis/VIN number on the compliance plate, may be registered at any motor
registry where:
• the vehicle is known to have been manufactured in Australia and known to be of a model that
complies with the Australian Design Rules,
This more so states what we are debating. It states that they will accept ADR's based on what the Model was recognised to have for the vehicle. NOT the adr's from the vehicle that was once attached to the donor chassis as claimed. In other words they will accept it as the vehicle it was.
What I keep on asking for is, from anyone, is a clause in the legislation that states what OZbox says. How can anyone take completely, 100% law, from the word of statements made by people, even an RTA officer, without seeing the clause in a legislated document that states it.
If this argument went to court it would be laughed out in seconds because one side of the argument has not one bit of legislated proof. Or at least has failed to provide it.
Last edited by TwoTees; 16-09-2011 at 10:44 PM.
Well, since I'm aboard...
The above rather lengthy legal statements I think you'll find only clarify that the car can be registered. It doesn't state anything about which vechile it's being registered as.
In this thread we've been given a number of real world examples (that place outside of legal documents) that people have given you of vechiles being registered as per the chasis not the body. From this we can make a fair conclusion that your once sandman is now likely to be registered as a hq if the swap was done following correct procedure.
More importantly to all of this. Can you imagine having this same 24 page discussion with any sandman collector and having them pass over the same or even close to the same money as they would for a car with a matching chasis?
Afterall, the point we're trying to make is that of 'Is this a collectable car that people are going to value and is worth throwing tens of thousands at a restoration?' or 'Is this a car that once was collectable but now has lost one of the key components that make it a collectable?'. From reading the comments here I'm again going to drawn the fair conclusion that the majority seem to lean towards the second option.
This is of course in no way going against the argument of 'who cares what it is, just drive it and love it' and if you look at the contents of my shed this is my personal taste. However, since the top end of the sandman market is no longer in the 'cheap fun' category but rather up there with the monaros in value, it is imporant for information about what makes your sandman a 'complete whole and collectable sandman' freely available. Then those who are doing their research on sites like this before a big purchase don't end up spending a great deal of money on the wrong car.
--- Updated ---
As requested, one goverment document stating clearly that in the case of a damanged chasis being replaced with a new or second-hand chassis the replacement chassis number becomes the primary vehicle identifier.
http://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/NR/rd...writetable.pdf
The simple fact is this, when you re-register any vehicle in NSW the authorised inspection agent only looks a two numbers, the chassis and engine number. If its only been out of rego for less than 3 months they will just look at the old rego papers. If more than 3 months they need to check the real numbers and give you a blue slip. They then base the identity of the car on thoses numbers. That is why the tags do not matter.
The body really could be anything from a HQ sandman van shell to a Nissan Patrol. It will still show on the rego papers as what ever the chassis came out of.
If they had given the chassis a part number and stamped the chassis number on the firewall, it would be as Two Tees states. Then the body and tags would be the identifier. They did not though, so the tags AND the chassis are the vehicle. the tags on their own are as good as the tags off an A9X Torana without the body, interesting, but incomplete.
The tags without the chassis identify what the vehicle was, not what it is.
Next up to the plate we have "The Goat". Hasn't done much during this match, just been sitting on the sidelines watching proceedings.
Here comes the pitch and the swing............
Wow! he really got a hold of that one. That ball is going way back....back...back.....and it's outta here!!!!!!
Well played Goat, well played.
As far as getting a car registered here in Adelaide, it seems that all you need is a rego number and an engine no. Way easier than i thought that it would be to be honest...
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