Maybe

[wbute]

Or PM me the engine number and i'll find out.

How do you find it out? I didn't think there were any records?

[playwme]

How do you find it out? I didn't think there were any records?

There's records. They just don't say "Sandman" and are a little incomplete if the dealership had lazy salesman who didn't like paperwork.

[HK1837]

Even if the number isn't recorded or the records are non existant I can tell by all the cars I have recorded ifan engine number ISN'T original or if it is likely to be the original.

[wbute]

So you need a huge data base of numbers.

[wbute]

There's records. They just don't say "Sandman" and are a little incomplete if the dealership had lazy salesman who didn't like paperwork.

That would be dealership records. Holden through the actual records out after a certain date which means that between all the effort to find date correct blocks for restorations that you really have to question a matching numbers engine unless you have dealer delivery documents. Just my opinion.

[HK1837]

That would be dealership records. Holden through the actual records out after a certain date which means that between all the effort to find date correct blocks for restorations that you really have to question a matching numbers engine unless you have dealer delivery documents. Just my opinion.

No, they are GMH records. They are Service/Warranty reports printed on A3 Z-fold paper out of the GMH IBM360 mainframe in the 70's. They are reported by PSN and list some of the information contained in the mainframe for each PSN. They were microfilmed at some stage and it is what Holden have today. Afaik they only have them for LC-UC, HQ-HZ but records stop mid 1978 and the 2nd half of 1974 Elizabeth HQ is missing. The LC-LJ mob have a whole copy of LC/J in electronic format which are photos of a microfiche viewer.

[wbute]

So what can you tell from these? You must be able to 100% identify engine and chassis numbers?
What records were thrown out?

[HK1837]

You can tell completion date, selling month, credited selling dealer, original specification (model and body), mechanical specification (eng, box, diff, air, steer and brakes) plus engine number and transmission serial number. Sometimes the engine and transmission serial numbers aren't recorded (rarely for transmission) either because dealer didn't send them back, the paperwork hadn't made it back to the zone office data entry point yet or for some other reason. Sometimes the dealer's code is masked so it isn't visible (normally internal cars eg the V8 LJ GTR's). Chassis numbers weren't recorded as they were not important to GMH. Even in the full mainframe record I don't think they were ever recorded. The full record for each car would have all the info on the car's construction (ie all the broadcast sheet data) plus ordering, wholesaling and selling dealer codes, paint, trim, all ordered options etc. If you can find a copy of Eric Blair's Torana book you can see an A9X report that shows some of this.

GMH would have turfed all the paper reports years ago but they have their 'fiche archives. They most likely turfed all the magnetic tape media years ago too when storage became static.

[wbute]

Can you tell if they are a Sandman?

[HK1837]

No, as Sandman isn't a model. Same with HQ GTS sedan, although you can pick a GTS350 sedan by the engine codes. XU1 is the same, you pick it by the engine and gearbox codes.